I started learning to fly 15 years ago & got within a few hours of getting my PPL - was in college, ran out of money, and finally quit. I'm interested in picking it back up again and I'm kicking around my options re buying, building and renting.
I'm certain an RV is in my future, but in the meantime I'd like to finish my PPL, instrument rating and commercial.
The cheapest rentals at my airport are Warriors @ $110/hr. If a good used 150/152 can work out to better than that over the course of, say, 300 hours - then I want one.
I found a plane that looks interesting. It belongs to an airline pilot friend of my uncle. Specs are:
1972 150L O-200 4810 TTAF 700 SMOH 490 STOH (*will explain this below) Annual on 11/05
Work done (@time)
Flap roller kit 4350 New spin-on oil filter 4350 New spark plugs M20 Air/Oil Separator 4409 New Door Windows 4427 Topped Cylinders 4427 Cowl Fastener Kit 4575 New Starter 4638 New Alternator 4682 New Battery 4694 New Voltage Regulator 4733 New Vacuum Pump 4805 New Carpet and interior Plastics 07-2000 New Leather Yoke Cover w/PTT 01-2003 New Garmin GTX-327 Xpdr 09-2004 IFR Static Check 09-2004
Bracket Air Filter Prop Guard Wheel Pants New Comm Antenna
Avionics:
Dual MX300s with a 3rd MX300 Spare (all 3 work fine) Loc/GS/VOR Cessna ADF Garmin GTX-327 Xpdr King Audio Panel w/ Marker Beacons Intercom
According to my uncle, who knows the owner and has flown with him, the plane is in immaculate shape and the owner has spared no expense to keep it that way. His kids got their PPLs and instrument ratings in the plane and he recently bought a twin so wants to sell this one.
He is asking in the neighborhood of $25k for the plane. AOPA's VRef says something near 30k.
Any thoughts?
Thanks!
-matt
*on the top overhaul 200 hours after the major: the previous owner had a 'major' done without doing the top. He put 200 hours on the plane over the course of 9 years. The current owner noticed oil blowing down on the fuselage, so he had a complete top overhaul done. Compression is supposedly where it should be and there are no known problems with the engine.
Glad you joined the best source of 150 information on the net before you buy!
You're going to get plenty of good advice here, and plenty of food for thought. Charles Hanna is the resident guru and more current on the regs than most of us. I question the validity of calling the engine 700 SMOH, considering the way you explained the "half and half" method!
Charles, can a mechanic split an overhaul this way, doing the top at a later date, and then sign off the engine as overhauled? Certainly still 700 hours total, but which date constitutes the overhaul? I've never heard of an engine accumulating 210 hours "during" an overhaul before!
Carl - thanks for yuor reply. Here is all I know about the 'split overhaul'. It does sound strange. I don't have immediate access to the engine logs, but here is what my uncle sent me:
I just spoke with (mechanic for last 5 years), who maintains the 150 regarding the engine times.
The engine was "majored" with the exception of the cylinders at the request of the previous owner. The aircraft then logged only about 200 or so hours over the next 8 to 9 years, i.e. it essentially sat.
(new owner) purchased the plane, and immediately noticed that the engine was throwing oil on the bottom of the fuselage. During the next annual, they had low compression on one cylinder and found a burnt ex. valve; which was corrected with a rebuilt cylinder. The expectation that the oil throwing would stop did not happen, so they removed all four cylinders, sent them out for complete rebuild with new pistons, etc.
Since the final top overhaul, there has been no problem, nor any oil throwing from the engine. Because they like to keep the oil topped, they also added the air-oil separator at that time. Whenever high oil is stirred or splashed in a crankcase, there is a tendency for the oil breather to pass it out and dirty the bottom of the airplane. Because they didn't know if the oil throwing was caused by breather issues or cylinder issues, they wanted to make sure they fixed the problem, and prevented it in the future. Between the new top overhaul and the air-oil separator, the oil stays inside the engine, and everything appears to be really great.
One thing I found to be very important is to have a mechanic without any interest in the plane do a pre-buy inspection. That saved me thousands. The owner of that plane thought it was in great condition, but they found some un-airworthy work that the owner's A&P had performed among other issues. It does sound like it's been maintained well. As for the cost comparison, don't forget the safety and convenience of owning. The plane is ready to go whenever you are. I had a couple scary experiences in rentals and just about stopped flying until I bought 40S. Then I finished up the PPL.
Thanks for your reply, Eric. I'm interested in hearing what owners are experiencing as far as ongoing costs are concerned.
Insurance, tiedown, fuel, oil, etc... are easy to predict (I have them already). I plan to keep the plane for 300 hours give or take, then sell it, hopefully recovering the majority of what I pay for it. I can afford routine service, but it's really going to hurt if I have to replace the engine or have it overhauled.
I am also in the process of buying a 150 (provided I can find a good one ). I agree, the pre-buy is worth the cost. It will save you a lot of trouble later. Also, don't get your hopes up too high on this one. Something may happen where you need to let it go. Use your head and listen to what these guys tell you, they have some great advice.
Pat
Never run out of altitude, airspeed, and ideas at the same time.
Looks good to me. Of course you want a pre-buy inspection. There are NO guarantees that the engine won't crater on you in the next hour after you buy it, but from your description it looks pretty sound.
Matt, where you are located plays a part in cost. Each area of the country seams to have different rates. I would treat it like an annual and then you know for sure. Texas ranges from $300-600.00 depending. Let us know where you are at and we might be able to steer you in the right direction.
). I agree, the pre-buy is worth the cost. It will save you a lot of trouble later. Also, don't get your hopes up too high on this one. Something may happen where you need to let it go. Use your head and listen to what these guys tell you, they have some great advice.