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I can understand your point Bill but I also see the other side of the issue. If one of the first questions is regarding damage history and the seller evades the question, it could be telling.

Your response to a potential buyer I would've considered an evasion. But it rendered the whole thing moot as the plane was no longer for sale. As the seller, you do have the right to choose with whom you do business.

Sometimes you just have to go by gut feel.

As the fleet ages, it's going to get harder and harder to find planes without damage history. Learning how to evaluate an airplane with a damage history is going to become more the norm. Even a plane without a damage history could have problems like corrosion.

It does make it a little difficult but I hope not impossible. The plane is listed on eBay and I note that one of the potential buyers is in Turkey. Hope he doesn't end up with one.

Bill,

Thanks for bringing up the other half of the equation.

I look at the damage issue a lot like you do I think. I would not necessarily be put off by an airplane that has been damaged and repaired well but I take your point about choice of language. Don't know if you've been following the other thread about the guy trying to sell the super duper 152 Sparrow Hawk. That guy clearly should have gotten some pointers on how to market his airplane because the approach he has taken has turned off many potential buyers, well at least me.

The same point holds true for buyers too. As the old saying goes, it takes two to tango. The negotiations involved have the potential to be a lot more complicated than walking into a Krispy Kreme for a dozen glazed.

I hope my email asking about damage didn't come across the wrong way. Since his listing was on eBay there were several other questions and answers already posted and mine was a follow on to what had already been discussed. He didn't seem to take offense but then you never know.

With 7 hours to go the eBay bidding is up to $18K for this airplane.

1979 152 TTAF 7426. TSMOH 1761. And, oh, fresh annual with sale.

I am not in the bidding.

If an aircraft suffers major damage and is repaired in accordance with all design requirements is a new airworthiness certificate provided by FAA with a new issue date?

You can have a totaled out A/C repair it and the FAA is not required to look at it. It does get a little more difficult if the Airwortiness ticket was surrenderd. Then you may have to either get the FAA involved or get a DAR. not sure on that. There is an old mechanices saying. If you have a data plate you have an A/C. I have seen a log book entry where they replaced the fusalage assy. Logged it using the fusalage P/N.

Your friend was lucky - I've heard stories (some from an FAA employee) in which the FAA goes after the current owner/pilot for flying an unairworthy airplane. Yes, the previous owner and mechanics are at fault, but ultimately it's the pilot who's responsible for the airworthiness of the aircraft.

I think the unscrupulous sellers know this and realize that, most of the time, the new owner will be just as on-the-hook from the FAA and therefore won't pursue prosecution.

SEE? It's just best to leave the FAA out of things entirely!

The problems that I ultimately found with Mr. Ed were most certainly maintenance personnel related. (Muffler. Fuel lines and valve. Motor mounts. Other more minor squawks.) I am pretty certain that the owner thought he sold me the aircraft that he described to me. For his whole demeanor was straight forward and honest.

Bill
Grants Pass, Oregon

Still not sold. Bidding at $19,451. Seller has lowered his reserve but no acceptable bids since the auction ended Wednesday. It will be interesting to see where it ends up for sale next as the seller is an aircraft dealer.

This is the airplane that the seller seemed reluctant to talk about damage history - saying only the logs showed damage to the left wing. The airplane was flipped in a landing accident, with what the NTSB called 'substantial' damage to left wing, crumpled fire wall and bent nose gear.

A good reason for owner assisted annuals. Even then, not everything is inspected. In this recent project I have discovered a few hidden niggles. A good example are the left panel mounts, which were really shot. I think the panel was being held in place by the instruments. But who looks at those?

Another one is the nuts on the bolts that hold the yokes to the universals. Somebody had those off at sometime and reused the nylocs. Those nuts were just slightly tighter than hand-tight.

Forty-year old airplanes are gonna have some aches and pains and you won't find 'em until you crawl through every inch of the airplane. And who does that?

Reg